There are certain things that really shouldn’t happen. Elephants shouldn’t fly. Baseball players shouldn’t cry. Humans shouldn’t eat mushrooms willingly (it’s a fungus y’all, come on).
Perhaps more importantly than any of the above, Thor should NOT beat Thanos in a standalone knockdown dragout brouhaha. And of course that’s exactly what happens in Dan Jurgens and John Romita Jr’s early 2000’s Thor #21-#25.
Here’s the thing: I’m more than ok with Marvel heroes overachieving. Should Spider-Man really be able to walk away the victor in an issue with Loki, god of mischief? Not really. But it happens, and I get it – Spidey’s the hero, and he’ll generally pull out a victory through some combination of guile and fortuitous luck.
But Thanos losing a one-on-one fight? Thanos! In essentially his first story arc, the Mad Titan imprisons Kronos, aka CHRONOS, aka the cosmic embodiment of the life force.
So let’s get one thing out of the way real quick: while it’s not a huge stretch to imagine Thor holding his own in any fight (especially one where Odin and some weird Troll dude send him magic armor and weapons), this is Thanos we’re talking about. Any story that ends with Thanos beaten the same way Thor might beat the Absorbing Man is seriously problematic.
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Wait, is this the worst Thanos story?
A little while back, I stated that Thanos Rising, the ongoing Infinity prelude from Jason Aaron & Simone Bianchi, is the worst Thanos comic of all time.
A reader was quick to point out that this Thanos appearance in Thor #21-#25 was so appalling it was retconned twice – once by Peter David and once by Thanos-creator Jim Starlin.
While Starlin’s decision to wipe out any Thanos story he didn’t write is kind of an awesome power move (what’s mine is mine y’all!), Thanos actually isn’t all that poorly written by Dan Jurgens here.
Thor #21 was published in March of 2000, and as such this series really feels its age. There’s a period of comics transitioning from the late 90’s on through the early millennium that feel and look extremely dated, and this Thor story arc is no exception. There’s a lot of story time given to a Thor alter ago I had never heard of (Jake Olson anyone?), and Mangog gets prime real estate as a stud Thor villain.
End of the day, it’s not a particularly essential Thor story, and frankly, unless you’re really interested in the complete Thanos reading arc, I’d pass on the run.
But – that doesn’t mean this is a terrible incarnation of Thanos. Yes, I have problems with Thor’s ultimate beatdown of the cosmic destroyer (and you should too), but Thanos’ goal is very much in line with his character.
In short, Thanos is collecting cosmic artifacts – the Chalice of Tears and the Map of All-Ending – in an effort to destroy the universe. If Thanos had a weekly to-do list up on his fridge, you know what it would say?
1) Collect cosmic artifacts
2) Destroy the universe
3) Milk?
So again, I have to think Starlin’s no-doubt retcon of Thanos from this story (he claims the Thanos in this Thor arc was a clone) has more to do with the ending than much of anything else.
Could I have done without Thanos making the weird, horribly ill-explained future lady cry? Yes. Yes, I absolutely could have done without that creepy foray into tear-rape. Nonetheless, it’s classic Thanos – manipulating someone into performing the exact act he needs without using much of his own force.
I can’t recommend Thor #21-#25 to anyone other than Thanos obsessives, but as it stands, I have to declare this is not the worst Thanos story I have ever read. It’s up there, yeah, but mostly this is a ridiculous romp through a middling Thor story arc. Thanos Rising can rest safely in the knowledge that its incomparable evil stands tall.
View Comments (11)
I thought Thor vs Thanos was fantastic as well.
Jim Starlin's issue with this Story wasn't Thanos losing but his characterisation. After Infinity Gauntlet, Starlin had Thanos stop being a genocidal villain who goes after mystical macguffins. This Story, as well as Mark Waid's run on Ka-Zar, regressed Thanos into that type of villain without explanation. So, for a continuity and storytelling standpoint, i have no problem with the Infinity Abyss retcon.
This fight needs to be approached objectively based on a one on one sanctioned fight where the two are engaged in close quarters combat. Thanos and Thor have equal ratings in strength, energy projection, durability and fighting skill. They differ in intelligence and speed with Thanos rated higher than Thor 2 to 6. However, Thor is faster 7 to 6 and even though his rating is only 1 point higher, Thor can move faster than the speed of light. At that velocity only an equal or higher rating would allow Thanos to see, sense and know when Thor is putting him in the mode. Thanos would have know idea where Thor's at or when he'll be there. Thanos' intelligence differs from Thor's in that Thor has a command of completely useless for information. Now down to the fight. It'd be over as soon as Thor utilizes the greatest super power any fighter could have, faster than light travel. Thor's superior speed and strength would all Thor would need to completely destroy Thanos in one punch. F = MA. Force = Mass x Acceleration and the speed at which Thor would hit Thanos would be so great Thanos would simply discentigrate by the kinetic energy produced from blunt forced trauma from of Thor's strength and speed. He can even swing Mjolnir at twice the speed of light. Using an objective analysis of Thor's powers makes him one of the most powerful being in any comic universe.
First, ratings: Intelligence, Strength, Speed, Durability, Energy Projection, Fighting Skills
Thor: 2, 7, 7, 6, 6, 4
Thano: 6, 7, 3, 6, 6, 4
Thanos with the exceptional level of knowledge aided by cybernetic enhancements, Thor much like myself with an IQ of 143 but a command of completely useless information. BUT Thanos FTW. Both in incredibly strong, nigh limitless levels of strength. We've seen what Thanos can do when he doesn't hold back but we've never seen Thor go full God mode without hesitation. He's afraid he'd destroy reality. Thor FTW Thanos is slow without his chair. Thor can move at the speed of light, track things moving faster than the speed of light, swing Mjolnir at twice the speed of light and instantaneously appear anywhere at anytime. Thor FTW. Energy projection both pretty much tied. The only difference would be Thor's emotional state. Go tap into the Thorforce and its a big Thorn FTW. Durability, Thor easy. Without cybernetic emuancememts Thanos would get paper cuts counting stolen money. Thor FTW. Both have similar levels of fighting skill but anyone with an IQ of 140 or above must understand a warrior God who's been in battles almost daily and who relishes anger or competition will win. Thor FTW.
1 - Thanos
2 - Thor
3 - Thor
4 - Thor
5 - Thor
6 - Thor
Gauntlets, gems, other factors like writer preference, fan missinformation, lack of understanding by all involved that his powers are limitless, he's the nigh omniscient Marvel character and the fact that Stan Lee himself created Thor for that single purpose. Now I think heroes/villains with powers like that are silly, too far fetched and inconceivable, but guys like Barry Flash with one super power he uses multiple ways instead of being an ascended God like powered Thor or Superman type hero. Speed is awesome and speed kills. You can transcend space and time with speed. We've done so by nanoseconds already, and Logan Wolverine, not that dumb x-23 poser, but the real deal are the favorites along with Black Panther, Batman, Daredevil and Blade up in there.
Great analysis. Totally agree: Thor beats Hulk. Thor beats Galactus. Thor beats Silver Surfer. Thor beats the Celestials. OF COURSE Thor beats the over-rated Thanos. Thor beats anyone and everyone, anywhere and everywhere, any time and every time. The main reason Thor is found on the ropes is the need for there to be a story with a hero to struggle and prevail. Old Prune Chin is certainly a powerful and interesting villain. And yes, he’s a genocidal maniac in love with death. But he’s still just a villain.
I find Thanos greatly over powered, how can a Titan yes powerful achieve that type of strength to take on Thor and Hulk. Thor is a God, Hulk is a rage monster and Thanos race are Humans mutated to be super humans or if a Mutant was given the Super Soldier Formula is what Titans really are.
I find Thanos is over done he can do about anything with really no plausible reason to be able to do so unlike Thor who is a God and is part of the universe compared to Thanos who just got it from Augments that seem way to over to be plausible.
If that's the case why hasn't Loki upgraded himself he has realistically far more resources let alone natural abilities to achieve greater power than Thanos could ever achieve.
Old Prune Chin isn’t simply greatly over-powered. He’s WAY over-powered.
I think part of the explanation for Thanos' insane power is that he's not only a Titan, but a mutant/deviant Titan. So take a mutant on Super Soldier Formula and then augment that by a once-in-a-generation genetic enhancement.
Ironically, Marvel tried to explain his origins, but it was in the awful Thanos Rising series. I think I'd agree that I could go with some more explanation why he's as powerful as he is.
I know this is old as hell, but Thanos's father was the son of a god, and Thanos's father also created Drax, so it isn't anything too crazy that Thanos can defeat both Thor and the Hulk.
Don't forget when he was revived by death he was also empowered by her also. But yeah as to how he can control cosmic energy and be physically as strong as hulk or thor even before this I dunno. He's also somehow telepathically invincible.
I read Thor Vs Thanos and thought it was fantastic. Very Mellodramatic but all the characters do behave like their descriptions; Thor is rambling in old english throughout and Thanos is ticking things off his Armageddon to-do list.
Having said that i do consider your point that this is THANOS we're talking about but the deux ex machina used to help Thor is hilarious and fits really well since he is a diety afterall but gets a some magic armour and a robot to intervene.
i read Thanos Rising recently too and i thoroughly enjoyed it. I get the impression this is to give a new if not clearer interpretation of who Thanos is, especially to new readers. I personally felt i was being introduced to him in a new way and that i felt i knew him much deeper. This bodes well for Infinity when it hits because it has the origin of the villain laid out-we know where he is coming from.
This was a funny and thoughtful look at some great comics. Thanks for an enjoyable read.
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